jim1274 Posted June 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Maybe your dealer could do a dealer trade for a 2013. Not sure how many are around but there have to be some. Yeah, that is an option they mentioned--probably more likely if I get a fully loaded one--seems most come that way. I am leaning toward white--that does not seem to be a prevalent color from my limited search of new inventories at area only dealers It would be nice if Ford web site let you search dealer new inventory in greater area without changing zip codes to move out geographically on search. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EcoBrick Bob Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 I checked in IA. Two in Des Moines at different dealers. Both Black... Neither has PP. The dealer has much more flexibility in locating vehicles. They should be able to show all white ones, or do it based on options if you don't want some things like Nav or the 402(?) package. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2012 I checked in IA. Two in Des Moines at different dealers. Both Black... Neither has PP. The dealer has much more flexibility in locating vehicles. They should be able to show all white ones, or do it based on options if you don't want some things like Nav or the 402(?) package. Well, it is crunch time. Negotiated a bottom line price on the loaded red 2010 and went and checked out the new stripper silver 2012 and 2 loaded metallic black 2013's at the dealer. I have never owned a black car, but that metallic black was a pretty impressive finish. I played with a 2013 build spec, and you can't even get the 402a package with the Sony premium radio and the PP at the same time--the 2010 has that combo. So my build would probably be PP plus NAV--$42785 before dealer discount and the 1750 incentive. Bottom line is about $10-11K in savings by going with the 2010, and gaining a few options to boot along with the $ savings. I am leaning toward the 2010. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjhpadi Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 I don't believe it's the premium Sony radio, but in 2010 you couldn't get the ACC with the PP, also if I remember correctly you could not get the multi-contour seats, I am not 100% sure but I know that's the reason I didn't go with the PP, there were too many other things you could not get if you had the PP, maybe it was the nav...I just can't remember for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 I don't believe it's the premium Sony radio' date=' but in 2010 you couldn't get the ACC with the PP, also if I remember correctly you could not get the multi-contour seats, I am not 100% sure but I know that's the reason I didn't go with the PP, there were too many other things you could not get if you had the PP, maybe it was the nav...I just can't remember for sure.[/quote'] Here is the option list on the 2010: 401A (moonroof/Sony/heat-cool seats) PP Nav Multi contour seats So you can in fact get the multi-contour seats with the PP in 2010. The issue on the 2013 is no Sony with the PP. An odd thing if correct, but that is what it seems from the Ford site when you try a build combining the two. A moot point--going to call seller and do the 2010 deal in a few minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TractorAK Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 Well, it is crunch time. Negotiated a bottom line price on the loaded red 2010 and went and checked out the new stripper silver 2012 and 2 loaded metallic black 2013's at the dealer. I have never owned a black car, but that metallic black was a pretty impressive finish. I played with a 2013 build spec, and you can't even get the 402a package with the Sony premium radio and the PP at the same time--the 2010 has that combo. So my build would probably be PP plus NAV--$42785 before dealer discount and the 1750 Bottom line is about $10-11K in savings by going with the 2010, and gaining a few options to boot along with the $ savings. I am leaning toward the 2010. what does the Sony premium offer that the Sony system in 402a doesn't? Here is my sticker. Sorry little blurry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 what does the Sony premium offer that the Sony system in 402a doesn't? Here is my sticker. Sorry little blurry. I was wrong. Just went back to Ford build screen, and I had to delete the PP to add the 402A, but it let me put PP back in on the next screen. Odd, but I guess just a quirk in the sequence of adding things to the build. Sorry. PS: See you have the tuxedo black--really liked that a lot when scoping colors at the dealer--that would be the one on a 2013 for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TractorAK Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 I was hesitant on getting black but due to the fact it was the only one I bought it. Then I bought a pressure washer and California duster. I love the color but there is more upkeep than my silver (never owned black car before). My neighbors must think I have OCD I live off of a dirt alley so I drive slow comming and going and usually give it a rinse and rub down before putting her to bed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjhpadi Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 Watch the California Duster, it will give you swirls on the finish...you would really be better served to use some waterless wash and a soft microfiber towel then the California Duster...using it is asking for damage to the finish...I had one but will not use it because of the swirls it creates because it holds the dirt in the duster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TractorAK Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 Cool thanks for the info I was wondering if there was a product that would repel dust. I assume that is what the waterless wash does. I was looking at duster and was thinking how could it not eventually scratch the clear coat. Is there a brand name for the waterless wash or is that it? I'll start searching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 That black really looks nice with the wheels too....But moot for me now.... Left the 2010 seller a message last night that I am going to buy the (red) car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpd1151 Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 You've lost me now..... a red one? Huh? Silver stripper, used 2010, 2 new black ones, and what? Sent from my DROID3 using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 The red one is the used loaded 2010 I have been discussing with seller ever since starting search. The others are new ones on Currie Ford Lot that I looked at. They have a Silver 2012 stripper and 2 loaded black 2013's (had about every option except PP) It came down to the 2010 or a new 2013--decided that the 2010 was the best deal after seller made a couple price concessions. If it works out, I will have the 2010 on Saturday. If not, I will move forward and order or dealer trade find a 2013. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watts Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 Optimum No Rinse (ONR) is one of the best no rinse washes. You basically wash the car with a microfiber and then dry it off with a microfiber - no rinse. It's not a soap but a polymer product that acutally bonds to the paint to prevent scratches as you dry. http://www.detailersdomain.com/Optimum-No-Rinse-Wash-Shine-NEW-FORMULA_p_154.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fueld13 Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 Watch the California Duster' date=' it will give you swirls on the finish...you would really be better served to use some waterless wash and a soft microfiber towel then the California Duster...using it is asking for damage to the finish...I had one but will not use it because of the swirls it creates because it holds the dirt in the duster.[/quote'] Assuming the only time you use the duster is after a clean wash and wax, and only with light dust, why would it swirl the paint? Shouldn't there be at least a thin layer of wax protecting the finish? I ordered a California duster but haven't been able to use it yet since I figure I won't use it until the paint has a nice layer of polish and wax first? Also, I use my air compressor to blow off the majority of the dust first, so hopefully with what little dust is left I don't get swirls. I guess I'll find out and report back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fueld13 Posted June 21, 2012 Report Share Posted June 21, 2012 Good luck Jim!!! The red one sounds like a great deal, but you can't go wrong either way!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 Good luck Jim!!! The red one sounds like a great deal' date=' but you can't go wrong either way!!![/quote'] Thanks for the encouragement--I need it today. After talking with Ford credit (has note on the car) today, I am leery of buying a used car without clear title in hand. I probably need to go visit my BMV to make sure this is done correctly--more than just a simple bill of sale needed for out-of-state purchase. That new 2013 is looking better and better..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpd1151 Posted June 22, 2012 Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 That '13 is even better looking knowing in the back of your mind, that LMS has cracked the ECM in order to upload their aftermarket tune. Just say'n :whistle: Sent from my DROID3 using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 That '13 is even better looking knowing in the back of your mind, that LMS has cracked the ECM in order to upload their aftermarket tune. Just say'n :whistle: Sent from my DROID3 using Tapatalk 2 Spent the last hour looking at the 2013 SHO build page...connect the dots.... I was thinking a PP and Nav for options, but the PP comes with summer only tires, which is an issue. I already have a 3 season only performance car, the new SRT, in the garage--the SHO will have to do year 'round duty. I SWORE, after trading the Boxster in on the SRT a couple weeks ago, I would NEVER switch tires seasonally on a car again. Did not see an option to spec all season tires with the PP. Suppose I could skip the PP, but that seems to be heresy on this car. The hassle with the title on the 2010 seems to be an omen, maybe. This has been the roughest buy ever on a car, and I have bought more than a few. The SRT buy was wham-bam--this one is like work! I guess there is a reason I've never bought a used car in my life since the first one in 1977...why change now!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EcoBrick Bob Posted June 22, 2012 Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 If it's any help, Livernois 2010 & their new 2013 SHO are NOT the Performance Package SHO's. The stock brakes can be updated by installing better pads if you don't feel they're up to the task. A Tranny Oil cooler can be installed using 2013 factory parts, or a good speed shop can install a B & M Cooler for around $200. or 1/2 the cost of the ford unit. Lighter wheels and tires will help performance, and smaller diameter ones help 2.73 axle ratio. You can do a lot for the $2,000. PP cost, that will make your non-PP faster than almost all PP SHO's. While I don't own a SHO, I probably would if I lived in the north in the winter months. Also... have you done a search for a used MKS. Personally, if I wasn't going the PP route, I would be looking at an MKS as they have neutral interiors available, and are just as fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EcoBrick Bob Posted June 22, 2012 Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 I just checked Auto Trader... There are over 100 2010-2013 used SHO's and even more EcoBoost MKS. Many are certified and there are low mile cars under $30,000. at dealers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 If it's any help, Livernois 2010 & their new 2013 SHO are NOT the Performance Package SHO's. The stock brakes can be updated by installing better pads if you don't feel they're up to the task. A Tranny Oil cooler can be installed using 2013 factory parts, or a good speed shop can install a B & M Cooler for around $200. or 1/2 the cost of the ford unit. Lighter wheels and tires will help performance, and smaller diameter ones help 2.73 axle ratio. You can do a lot for the $2,000. PP cost, that will make your non-PP faster than almost all PP SHO's. While I don't own a SHO, I probably would if I lived in the north in the winter months. Also... have you done a search for a used MKS. Personally, if I wasn't going the PP route, I would be looking at an MKS as they have neutral interiors available, and are just as fast. Thanks, Bob, as I am done waffling around and need some real help now getting the right spec on a new 2013. The more I think about it, a used 2010 just does not seem that compelling when I can get in a brand new 2013 for about 8500 bucks more by giving up the options. If this title lien issue and added risk had not surfaced, I probably would be posting a photo of the 2010 on Saturday. I am not 100% ruling out the 2010, but if the seller does not have some more definite answer soon on getting the title issue resolved, I am getting a '13. First off, yes I did search for a used MKS. There are a lot fewer of them on the used market, and I did not see any that looked like promising deals. I searched the forum using "2013" search term and read everything found to get some insight on the PP and such. Found some help, but not a lot of threads yet. The best way to make a call on PP or no PP would be to find a dealer with both and test drive. Have not found one--almost every 2013 car on the lots seem to be loaded non-PP cars. Not sure I really need the PP. We have some really lousy roads around here (everywhere anymore?), so a little more compliant suspension may not be a bad thing. Don't see this car going to the track, so is the extra cooling needed? I do love my big Brembos on all fours on the SRT, so the real brake upgrade on the '13 version of the PP caught my eye for sure. Those 20" wheels are pretty nice too for sure. I drove the non-PP 2013 and certainly did not find it lacking or a mushy suspension by any means. And with the SRT on the other side of the garage, not sure if I need the ultimate SHO performance. If the PP came with all-season tires, I might just spend the $2000 and be done with it. Anybody out there drive both the 2013 PP and non-PP cars and prefer the non-PP ride comfort?? Color selection is personal preference, so am on my own on that spec. (never owned a black car in my life--might actually make this my first one--wife liked the red) I really liked the Nav on my last 3 cars--check that box. The only other option that I really would like is the premium sound, but a $3000 package to get it seems like a lot of money, but a chunk of that goes to the BLIS and such. The premium sound in my SRT Challenger is really good and I think about that every time I skip over the 402A check box.... I may have just answered my own questions. The dealer had 2 black '13's with about every option available except the PP. The easy, but expensive, solution is to go over tomorrow and right the check and start driving. Hmmmm..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 oops..."write" the check...I am REALLY slipping... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1274 Posted June 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 I just checked Auto Trader... There are over 100 2010-2013 used SHO's and even more EcoBoost MKS. Many are certified and there are low mile cars under $30' date='000. at dealers.[/quote'] Found 11 SHO's within 30 miles and 7 MKS AWD. The MKS listings were not real clear on ecoboost--are all MKS that have AWD mean ecoboost too? Not up on the Lincoln model terminology. Actually saw one AWD MKS that looked promising if ecoboost--not clear from the ad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fueld13 Posted June 22, 2012 Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 I drove the MKS and then the PP 2013, I actually thought the ride was much more harsh on the MKS??? Go figure? Compared to the 2012 SHO interior the MKS seemed nicer, but the updated soft materials in the 2013 was on par with the MKS for sure. I ended up ordering a 2013 non-PP after much stewing. Ultimately I decided summer tires in Utah winters is a BAD idea, plus for $600 more I got the 20" wheels and all seasons anyhow. Also, now that I have used the adaptive cruise, I cannot imagine NOT having it! Wow! As for braking, its just upgraded pads on the PP, so that's not even a consideration to me...But the last lingering issue was that the non-PP would have "soft" suspension...NO WAY! After driving my 13 the last few weeks, I have absolutely no regrets, none! I actually wonder if Ford really puts different suspension on the two packages, they feel and ride identical. I'm certainly not trying to sway you in one direction, but I can say that I have no regrets getting all the added tech features that come in the non-PP, and the performance is exactly the same as far as I can tell. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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